Welcome to the Workology Podcast, a podcast for the disruptive workplace leader. Join host Jessica Miller-Merrell, founder of Workology.com as she sits down and guest to the bottom of trends, tools and case studies for the business leader, HR, and recruiting professional who is tired of the status quo. Now here’s Jessica with this episode of Workology.
Episode 312: Featuring Lisa Rosendahl, CHRO, U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:00:25.20] Welcome to the Workology Podcast, sponsored by Upskill HR and Ace The HR Exam. This podcast is part of a series on the Workology Podcast focused on the roles and responsibilities of the Chief Human Resource Officer, or CHRO. That CHRO is sometimes called the SVP of HR or the Chief People Officer. It’s an executive or C-level role that deals with managing human resources, as well as with organizational development and implementing policies of change to improve the overall efficiency of the company. The CHRO podcast series on Workology is powered by Daily Pay and Ginger.com. One of the reasons I wanted to do this series is because there’s a lot of mystery around that CHRO role. Whether you are currently in a CHRO position and looking to hear from peers, friends, mentors and understand what is demanding our attention. And for those future CHROs, understanding what our roles and responsibilities are and how to promote into a role like that later on in your career. We are talking about everything to do with the Chief Human Resource Officer. Today, I’m joined by Lisa Rosendahl. She’s the CHRO at the US Department of Veterans Affairs. She’s a former army officer. Lisa has over 25 years of hands-on full-cycle strategic HR operations experience in the public, private and federal sectors. Lisa, welcome to the Workology Podcast.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:01:55.98] Well, thank you. I’m glad to be here today.
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:01:58.83] I’m very excited to chat with you today. We have known each other for a really long time and, and that’s dating us, I guess a little bit. But we’ve known each other while we met on social media a really long time ago, and I am so excited to hear about, more about your background and share with others because you have recently transitioned into a new role in your job. So to back up, I want to hear a little bit about your background and how did you get into HR and talk to us about how your career and your job in HR has evolved into your current role?
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:02:35.67] All right. Jessica, I love to be able to say that it was all by design, but my career has been anything but by design. So, I came to HR by way of a biology degree and almost 10 years of time as an officer in the army. I was an ordinance officer, so I worked in supply, maintenance and transportation. After about 9 years, 9 months and 27 days in the military, I decided that it was time for a change. I was interested in settling in a community, raising a family, and at that time, my career with the military really wasn’t going to offer me that. I was hired by an international paper company for their bench strength program, which is sort of like an internship program. And while I went and I interviewed for a logistics position, they offered me an HR position. I didn’t know much about HR at the time. And frankly, what I knew about HR wasn’t really appealing to me. In my mind at the time, HR was a bunch of people who sat in a room and said, you know, Harry’s been here 27 years. It’s time for a pay raise. Let’s give Harry a pay raise. And after traveling around the world and being a really dynamic officer in the military, it just wasn’t something that was appealing to me. So I initially had declined their opportunity and then they offered to, offered me to come to Minnesota and spend a week with their HR department on the ground. And I’ll tell you, that was probably a really smart thing for them to do because what I saw was very different than what I had expected. It was anything but old or routine.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:04:06.03] The mill that I went to had a very progressive HR organizational development team. They were very collaborative with their union. They were on the mill floor. HR staff were engaged with the employees and I, frankly, I just loved it. It was the energy was just addicting. So I moved to Minnesota, worked for this international paper company and then after a few years there, I transitioned out of the paper mill to an HR department of one for a private family held business across town. Was there for probably about six years, and then I transitioned again to the other side of town to be an HR Officer for a VA medical center. I was there for over 15 years when I moved to our network office. I was a Deputy Human Resource Manager and now in my current role as a Regional or a Chief Human Resource Manager. So for my career from the jobs in the military through my career progression, I started off very practical day to day hands on from building programs from the ground up to progressively more strategic roles. Me, just the way I’m built, I still have my hand in the day to day operations. I personally really enjoy seeing how all the pieces fit together. I really could never work in a silo. I have this need to understand what’s happening around me and to make my decisions in, in context. So I’d say, you know, said you and I have known each other for a while and, and we have. And over that time HR as a profession has really shifted from transactional and compliance to really more of a strategic trusted advisor. And that really has what I’ve experienced throughout my career.
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:05:47.22] I love that, and I think I remember you mentioning when we have been at events together that you worked in HR at a paper mill. That’s kind of how you started your career. But I hadn’t heard the whole, the whole kind of progression. So I love that it has moved kind of like HR in general from really sort of day to day, administrative to, to your current role, which is more strategic position. In your LinkedIn bio, you mentioned that you worked with a leadership coach early in your career. I wanted to touch on that and talk about maybe why you did that and then what you learned from the experience.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:06:28.32] Oh, of course it was. It was a wonderful experience. At the time, I don’t necessarily think that I thought that it was, but it really it really turned out to be. So when I left the paper mill and I started working for a privately owned company, it was a manufacturing business. Our owner was very, very progressive and he really devoted time to leadership development. So I was part of his leadership team and he hired a coach to work with us to really to better the business, to make sure that we work together as partners, and that we were able to develop our, our leadership skills. So having had that opportunity to work with the coach then really was like, I said, it was one of the greatest gifts I had, and I didn’t always feel that way. It’s hard to sometimes to see yourself through other eyes and have people point out to you where you may be missing the boat on things. I had a vision of myself as a leader who was impacting people and making a difference in a way that I thought was positive. But it was quickly brought to my attention that the way that I thought I was doing leadership or being a leader really wasn’t the way that I that I was being perceived by others, I was really creating chaos in, in my wake.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:07:41.61] So it was really clear to me that I wasn’t being the leader I wanted to be and I frankly was standing in my own way. So I was able to use the coach to help me, in a sense to get out of my way. So we worked with the coach at the company for a couple of years, and then our engagement ended. I didn’t work with her much after that until I then moved on to a follow on position and I saw some of my same behaviors happening again. The things that were happening with me in my previous job when I, when we first had the coach that I thought I fixed were were coming out again and my relationships were impacted. I believe my effectiveness as a leader was being impacted, so I personally sought her out and engaged her on my own and work with my coach for on and off for a couple of years. One of the things that I, that I learned from the coach is, it’s me. It’s all about me. If things are not working in my relationships or things are not working in my, in my leadership, it all comes back to me and what I could have done differently. I can tell you, Jessica, there’s a lot of times I would drive down to her office and I’d say this time I’m going to present this case to her, and she’s going to say, Lisa, this is not you.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:08:53.34] It’s the other person. And every time I’d get back in my car, I drive back home and I’m like, Darn it, it was me again. And she really helped me see how, how I can approach situations differently, how I can take responsibility for the things that I do to make, to make a difference with those around me. It was so valuable that when I moved into this role here, because this is very different than my other roles, it’s much less operational and very strategic. I am working with a coach now to help me bridge that gap to make sure that I can stop some of my own, my old ways of being, and I could really keep my eye focused on the on the larger picture. There are so many demands and expectations set on us as as leaders. I don’t know why anybody wouldn’t want somebody in their corner to help support them. So if you have any listeners or anybody that wants to question the value of a coach or talk to anybody about the benefits of it, I am a strong proponent and I would love to speak to everybody because it frankly has changed the way that I lead.
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:09:57.36] I love you being so open and honest and transparent about this because I think a lot of people do engage coaches, but they don’t often talk about it and how it might have it impacted them personally and professionally.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:10:11.40] Oh, if you want to hear stories, we can have some coffee and I can tell you some stories.
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:10:16.41] Another thing I wanted to ask you is about skills and experiences, and what you believe are absolute requirements for a CHRO role, especially when thinking about maybe those HR leaders who are listening right now and just starting out in the industry. What skills and experience do they really need?
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:10:34.89] So I think that’s a, that’s a tough question because I don’t know that there’s necessarily a cookie cutter set of skills that I can say do A, B and C, and here’s how you can progress through your career because I’ve listened to some of your, all of your CHRO podcasts and we all get to our roles so many different ways with so many different sets of experiences. But I’d say when I thought about it, if I had to sum it up or capture maybe three larger buckets, I think the first one would be an understanding of the business and how HR is delivered in the context of the business that you’re part of. And I think maybe one of the examples I can give is HR professionals, especially today, if not at all times, retention of key staff is always one of the challenges that, that we’re facing. But the context really matters or/and the context really, really matters how you advise or how you assist the retention of key staff in a central Minnesota manufacturing company where you’re one of the higher paid employers is different than retention of key staff in an international paper company, where it’s been in the community for 20 to 30 years, and fathers and sons and mothers and sisters work there, different set of challenges, and both of those are very different than staffing a health care facility in the throes of a pandemic. So they’re skills that we need to bring to the, bring to our, to our job every day, to us every day. But it’s really important for us or incumbent on us in our role to understand the business, understand what keeps our leaders up at night and to pick all the resources and tools to help them address problems.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:12:18.99] The second area, I would say, would be a consulter and an adviser. And I’d say that being a consultant, consultant and adviser for me is different than what I talked about in the first part about being a business knowledge. For me, this part is really about relationships, trust and credibility. In order for you to really know what’s on the mind of your leaders and what keeps them up at night, they have to want to talk to you and they have to see value in reaching out to you. So I, over the years, I’ve mentored a number of people, HR professionals, HR leaders at different points in their career. And one of the things that I listened for when they talk to me about issues that they might be having or feeling like their voice hasn’t been heard. When I hear phrases like I told them, or they didn’t know, or they didn’t do what I told them to do, or they didn’t do what I suggested, that really is a, is a point for me to stop and to talk to them about who they are as leaders and who they want to be and the importance of building those relationships. HR is not about being the no-no girls or the no-no boys or telling people what they, what they can and can’t do. But using the knowledge and skills that we have to find a way to move from A to B, and to make sure that our leaders, when they make decisions, they make informed decisions.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:13:34.05] And you can’t do that well, maybe I’m a little old school, but I don’t believe that you can do that well if you don’t know the people and you haven’t earned their trust and you don’t have the credibility. So I think it’s really important to build that. And I think building that really starts from day one with task one, and it’s something that you can’t stop. You can’t let your guard down. You need to continue building it throughout your career. There’s not, not that there’s not going to be missteps or there’s not going to be messes that might be created. But if you go back and you acknowledge that a mistake was made and you go back and you clean up your messes, I think that does, that does a lot to building those relationships and building your credibility with others. The other area, I think there’s probably the top three is, is personal leadership. Is, you know, I talked a little bit about myself and my leadership as a coach. I talked about building, building relationships. But I also think or/and I also think knowing who you are as a leader and who you want to be and doing things to keep your, your skills current and also taking care of yourself, you could know the business, you can know HR delivery, you can build relationships. But if you’re burnt out or you’re distracted or you’re overly stressed, you’re not going to be able to be there for others. So I, I would say that’s probably maybe the more traits or maybe the more ways of delivering service than skills and experience, but hopefully that, hopefully that hit on it.
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:14:58.69] Any insight into this area is valuable because so many people think that it’s one thing or you have to take this one class or get this one degree. And it’s a unique experience for every person in HR and it’s different. But I do feel like there’s some key components of those of certain skills and experiences that we really should be, should be thinking about to have kind of in our tool belt. Once we, as we’re going through that career progression in HR.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:15:30.15] Yeah, thank you.
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:15:31.50] You have been in HR and the public sector as well as the private sector, and now you work for the Federal Government. I wanted to ask you what you think is the most significant difference in working in HR for the private sector versus the Veterans Administration?
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:15:49.53] So I would say, the HR, we talked a little bit earlier about it and move from tactical to being strategic, and it’s great that we’re strategic and we definitely need to be. And having said that, HR always has this, right now, a very strong compliance component. And in the Federal Government, that’s not different. I mean, we have a very, very strong compliance component. And I think working in the Federal Government, the context is very is very critical. A couple of things that come to mind here is one we are. We are taxpayer funded, so we have a responsibility to the public. We have a huge workforce. We have a myriad of laws, rules and regulations which often require oversight by Congress. So there’s a lot of or multiple types of reports that are required, and most of our guidance does does come down from law. And maybe as I kind of think about how things flow because this is something that I needed to when I was new to the Federal Government to really understand and get my head around is our guidance comes, comes from law, then it, then it trickles down through all of the agencies, so it’ll go through the Office of Personnel Management, then it will come to the Veterans Administration, and then it will come to me through the Veterans Health Administration. So when we’re making decisions or we’re affecting actions, context of what guidance you’re following and where it came from is very, is very critical. So you so you have the larger picture of what you’re of, what you’re managing.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:17:24.07] Within the Federal Government, we also have multiple personnel systems. So within VHA, where I am is the Veterans Health Administration, we have a personnel system, which is the Title 5 system, which is, I’ll say, basically primarily our admin staff or our non-clinical staff. Then we have our Title 38 personnel system, which is our, our, our doctors, our nurses, our optometrists, our physician’s assistants, our staff that provide direct patient care. And then we have a combination called our hybrid Title 38, which is a little bit of Title 5 and a little bit of Title 38. And those are like our nurses, our psychologists, our, our social workers. And the tricky part about that is the way that you hire people, the way that you set their pay, the way that they’re promoted, some of their employee rates or their labor employee relations obligations differ based on the type of system that they’re in. So that just adds a level of complexity to what we do that you don’t see in the federal sector. So as somebody that likes to dig into things and understand where they came from and connect the dots and really follow things from beginning to end, it’s really very exciting to me to, to work through all of that and to understand the context within which we’re operating. And to answer the questions that were asked to within the, within the correct context.
Break: [00:18:50.38] Let’s take a reset. This is Jessica Miller-Merrell and you were listening to the Workology Podcast, sponsored by Upskill HR and Ace The HR Exam. We’re talking about the role of the CHRO in the federal sector with Lisa Rosendahl. She’s the CHRO at the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs. The CHRO podcast series on Workology is powered by Daily Pay and Ginger.com.
Break: [00:19:16.21] Every employee has different mental health needs from preventive behavioral health coaching to therapy and psychiatry. Ginger offers effective, convenient mental health care for any level of need. All from a smartphone. Learn more Visit Ginger.com.
The CHRO in the Government Sector
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:19:34.49] Can you talk about HR modernization and the Federal Government, for example, you and I had talked about how you were moving from a facilities based model to a regionally based model.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:19:46.32] Of course, yes. We started on this journey within VHA a couple of years ago, and so what that means, let me just talk a little bit about what that means on the ground. Is within my network, we have a network office and we have eight facilities. So prior to HR modernization, each of those facilities had their own self-sustaining HR department. There was an H.R. manager, a full recruiting and staffing team, as well as a labor employee relations team and all of the benefits components. So it was pretty much a self-contained unit there. We had eight of those across the network and within VHA. We have 18 networks, so we had a number of facility based HR teams. Under HR modernization, we were shifting from this decentralized HR delivery model to a shared service or regional model. What that, what that meant for us was we looked at the services that could be consolidated to the regional level. So we basically have regionalized our core HR functions, which include our recruitment and placement functions, our labor, employee relations, work life benefits, our compensation workers comp, reasonable accommodation. All of those core HR functions are provided by a shared service team and that shared service team provide services across the eight facilities and all of those customers. Now our customer service was very important to us and we wanted to make sure that we did not lose focus with the customers. So we maintained an HR staff at each of the facilities. So where before modernization and HR manager was responsible for an entire HR department, the HR team at the facilities right now are designed to be consultants and advisors to the HR leadership to be able to be available day to day to answer the questions, to provide them the resources that they need, and they have the full force of the shared service teams behind them to do the technical, the day to day tasks for them and to provide them the information that they need.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:21:53.04] When I say that they are to be consultants and advisors, that’s our end state. We’re not quite there yet. We are moving through the modernization journey. We spent the first couple of years, first year and a half or two years getting all the pieces in place, establishing our shared service teams, aligning our staff where they needed to be and staffing up our functions. Our next two years or our next year or so as we, as we progress through, is looking at the processes that we have in place and standardizing them. We’re looking at standardizing our operating procedures or working on our role process and our, and our clarity. I mentioned that we had a facility based human resource team and we also have our shared service teams. As you can imagine, when you take eight facilities and you combine them into one group, there’s a number of different operating practices and, and procedures. There’s also where those handoffs occur are sometimes not clear. So what we’re working through now, not just within our network but with all within all 18 networks, is clarifying the roles in the processes between their shared service teams and the facility teams to make that flow well. And we’re also looking at our organizational structure and how we align our services. The other two things that we’re focusing on as we as we move forward is our customer experience.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:23:15.63] One of the biggest questions that we receive from our customers is when I have a question, who do I go to when I need HR help? So we are really focusing on our communication. We’re focusing on our structure. We’re focusing on our work alignment to make it easiest for the customer so that when they have a question, they know where to go to get, to get the answer. We’re also looking at service delivery expectations. We’re looking at service level agreements and service metrics and just staying in touch with our customers to make sure that we hear what they have to say and that we’re able to meet their needs. The third thing that we’re, that we’re focusing on is training. We’re, we, we’re at developing standardized training for our new hires for/to HR. We are training our current HR business partners as well as our, as our HR leaders. So this is, it’s, it’s, it’s a journey that we’re on. We’ve made great progress over the past few years, like I said in getting the organizational structure in place. And we have a number of teams with subject matter experts from all 18 networks looking at those standardized processes. And so when you come to VISN 23*, which is where I am, when you go to another VISN, the processes that we follow will be the same that will help for a customer expectations, help for service delivery and will also help for training and developing our staff. So when you learn it once you don’t need to learn it for different types of facilities. So it’s a really, it’s very exciting, and I’m really proud with the progress that we’ve made.
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:24:53.45] I love that and I think most HR professionals, whether you’re in public or private, can relate to, to this change, they’re likely going through something some sort of modernization of their own, although maybe adjacent or slightly different.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:25:09.71] Mm hmm, yes.
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:25:11.69] Another thing that I wanted to chat with you about is you talked a little bit about how the federal decisions, or mandates, or laws impact the direction that, that you and the Veterans Administration move forward. I wanted to talk a lot about all the changes that are going on in the federal level with executive orders and legislation that affects the federal employers like maybe vaccine mandates. How does this affect you and your team, these kind of executive order changes?
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:25:47.54] Ok, that’s a, that’s a very good question. So earlier on, when we talked about the Federal Government, we talked about the context, is understanding the context of where our guidance is coming from. So the vaccine example is a very relevant example because we’re living and breathing it today. So maybe I could start off with, probably, let’s go back to middle of August. So in the middle of August, the secretary of the VA had mandated that Title 38 health care professionals obtain vaccinations. There are provisions provided for medical and dental exemptions, but and our staff are required to comply with either the, the mandatory vaccine or one of, one of the exemptions. Now that was from the secretary of the VA, and it applies to VHA, which is a subordinate organization of his, and that’s the organization that I’m in. Concurrent with that, the White House has provided guidance encouraging the federal workforce, all members of the federal workforce to obtain a COVID vaccination. It wasn’t a mandate, but it was an encouragement that that happened. In response to that, the guidance from the VA and our VHA directives were updated to not include just our health care professionals, but all of our employees. So that is an example of how something happens at the executive level in the government and it trickles down through the organization to us. In addition to that, there was some guidance from the Safer Federal Workforce Task Force that is asking staff to attest to their vaccination status.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:27:32.45] So this is, this task force applies to the entire Federal Government. So not just VA or VHA, but all of the Federal Government, but how it impacts us is, this is in addition to the directive that we have for our vaccination statuses. So this is something that, that we are required to do in response to the Federal Workforce Task Force in regards to vaccinations. So it’s, things start at the executive level and then they make their way down through the different organizations. And as they go through the VA to the VHA, each of those organizations then build upon what was there before them to provide guidance to us. And so in my staff and my, my team as HR in VA, it’s our responsibility to understand their directives and to work to implement them. So on a day to day basis, right now we have there are some employee relations and labor relations impacts. We have some recruiting and staffing impacts and that staff that are hired now are subject to this directive. So we’re working with them to ensure that they’re able to meet that before they come on. And then also, when it comes to the mandatory vaccines, we do provide vaccinations to our staff. So with this being vaccinated, with the vaccinations being mandatory, we are staffing up our teams and our health care systems to be able to deliver those additional vaccines to staff as needed.
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:29:11.77] Perfect. I have not worked in the, in this, I guess, arena, so I’m not, I’ve never worked in Federal Government. And so I was curious like, how does this all work? So thank you for, for enlightening me and I think helping a lot of others maybe understand. I wanted to ask you about what’s going on on the blended or on site remote staff part of the world in terms of what’s happening in the Federal Government for the hybrid model? Are, are people opening up? Are people, as your team remaining remote, like how are you, how are you working through all these changes that I feel like are happening and very quickly?
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:29:55.80] Oh, of course. So in our team, I can probably speak best about what’s happening with, with my team. We’ve been within my network and maybe I can go back to probably March of 2020 when all of this started with, with the COVID pandemic and that, that event pretty much forced an overnight surge towards maximum telework where literally we were all in the office one day and everybody was working from home the next day. It was something that we were not able to plan for, but we were able to make, to make the shift. It was an adjustment in the beginning, but over the next, I guess, I probably say next 18 months or so we’ve learned a lot of lessons and have really settled into systems that, that, that support that hybrid or that work from home model. As things, I’m going to say started to open up, I know we’re in a very different situation now, but as things started to open up, we started to consider what, what’s next for us. And so where before the pandemic, we were primarily a, I’d say, a majority on site face-to-face boots on the ground organization. We have shifted to more of a hybrid model where we are able to offer some telework opportunities for our staff that are located at the facilities and also some remote or work from home opportunities for our shared service or regionally based staff. That has been a, definitely, an employee satisfier. It’s also, was something that was required, I would say, the, the market or our competitors around us where offering that. And we were not actually being very competitive with the market by not being able to offer those opportunities.
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:31:40.26] I think over the, over the pandemic time, our staff really have shown that they’re able to, to perform the work from that remote environment. Were able to maintain relationships with our customers and we’re continuing to tweak that along the way. And I think that has been a very, very positive shift for us. I would say also it’s when it comes to recruitment and retention of staff, we are more attractive to people that are looking for HR opportunities and are really looking for some of that flexibility and that workplace. And we are able to hire staff, not just from the immediate areas of our facilities anymore. We’re able to consider staff from outlying areas or different different parts of the country. So I think all in all, it’s been a very, very positive move for us. It’s not over, you know, it’s something that, that’s new and that we’re moving into and we’re looking at we’re continuing to look at how to continue to strengthen the relationships between the HR teams and the facility staff when they are remote and also amongst the teams when we have some people that are on site and some people that are working from home. The other, the other question that people have asked is, you know, for, for career development, if you don’t see me, how are you going to know what I’m doing? So we’re looking at career development and a hybrid environment to involve or also include how do we identify and develop leaders when we’re not face to face with them every day.
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:33:07.66] Lisa, thank you so much for taking the time to talk with us. It was great to reconnect with you. Where can people go to learn about you and the work that you do?
Lisa Rosendahl: [00:33:19.45] Probably the best place today would be LinkedIn. So you can find me at Lisa Rosendahl at, on, on LinkedIn.
Jessica Miller-Merrell: [00:33:26.92] Perfect. And we’re going to link to your LinkedIn profile over there so people can check you out, connect with you. If you have any more questions about the inter workings out of the Federal Government and maybe Lisa’s career in HR because it’s quite interesting. I feel like a military veteran moving into the HR role and then from paper mill to, to Federal Government, like, I feel like you have have covered all the bases. Thank you so much for taking the time to talk with us.
Closing: [00:33:55.27] It’s really interesting to delve into how a role like the CHRO, who’s experience more closely connects them to the strategy and operations of the overall business and how that works within the federal and government sector. I think that Lisa shared some really interesting insights. I’m always curious about how executive orders and decisions come from the government and roll into a department or an entity like Veteran’s Affairs and then how the Federal Government and HR is working to modernize their own internal HR departments. I appreciate Lisa taking the time to share with us her experiences today. Thank you for listening to the Workology Podcast sponsored by Upskill HR and Ace The HR Exam. This podcast is for the disruptive workplace leader who’s tired of the status quo. The CHRO series is powered by Daily Pay and Ginger.com. My name is Jessica Miller-Merrell. Until next time, you can visit Workology.com To listen to all our previous podcast episodes.
Closing: [00:35:00.04] Personal and professional development is essential for successful HR leaders. Join Upskill HR to access live training, community, and over a hundred on demand courses for the dynamic leader. HR recert credits available. Visit Upskill HR.com For more.
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